I know I recently said that I don’t often mention Mark VIs on my blog because I figure they get enough airtime everywhere else. However, yesterday I came across something that I wrote a few months ago on another site, that I think is worth repeating on my own website.
Photography by H. Kahlke ©2009
I was responding to a blog post that Neil of Sax Station had written about the Selmer Mark VI. I really believe this is to a large degree why the horns not only were popular to begin with, but continue to enjoy the popularity that they do.
Here’s what I said:
Being a Mark VI owner, as well as the owner of many other vintage saxophone brands including Martin, Conn, King, Buescher (all be it a bass), and various European brands as well such as Pierret, Hammerschmidt, et al, I firmly believe that one of the reasons that the Mark VI continues to have such staying power, is the versatility of its tone. It can switch from classical to jazz to rock with relative ease, and it does so quite convincingly. These traits are not something I’ve found in any of my other vintage saxes. While the Pierret, for example, is a wonderful classical or jazz horn, it would not do well in an electric environment. While on the other hand, the King Zephyr would not be a convincing classical saxophone.
While the Mark VI may have started out being the choice of the pros in the 50s when it first came out, and then everyone decided that they wanted to have one, today’s players have more choices obviously. Although many may still continue to chase the sounds of Getz, Coltrane, or the modern players like Sanborn, the fact is the Mark VI still offers greater tonal versatility than any other “vintage” sax IMO. (I’m putting vintage in quotes since there is some debate whether or not the Mark VI is truly a vintage horn. Based solely on its age it would qualify.)
Only time will tell which of today’s current crop of modern horns will have the staying power of the Selmer Mark VI. One thing is for certain, I’d be willing to bet these ones aren’t it… 😆
Source: eBay.com
This is a Very High Quality Professional Green Gold Tenor Saxophone Sax in Brand New Condition. This Saxophone is All Hand-Craft work and provides Highest Quality Italian.
Features:
- French Super Style
- Bb Key with High F# key
- Durable Body & Keys
- With Highest quality Italian
- U.S.A. Mouth Piece (Including Reed )
- Includes:
- Factory Set Up
- Cleaning Cloth
- White Gloves
- Neck Strap
- Hardshell Case
- A complete package with everything you need to start playing!
- Professional Quality with Factory Direct Price!!!
- 1 Year Factory Warranty ( Against Manufacture Defects )
Source: eBay.com
After finding out that the tenor sax I bought in 1962 and played on countless gigs in the New Orleans area is valuable and highly prized, I decided to check out whether registration was possible. It is a Selmer Mark VI (Serial number M102226) and is a wonderful instrument to play and apparently to listen to. Until recently I had no idea that my horn was special, although I have been complimented many, many times for the wonderful sound it produces.
In seeking how to register it, or whether is was even possible, I learned the following: Yes, it can be registered in the Selmer Paris database, but only by the original purchaser – second-hand horns cannot be registered. Therefore if your horn was purchased brand new by you and you have maintained sole ownership of that instrument contact Thierry Doublon (tdoublon@selmer.fr) One thing I learned by trial and error, this guy is in Paris, France and may not fully understand English. I had to use the google english to french translation application to email in french what I wanted.
Ron Fahrenbacher
proud owner of Selmer Mark VI tenor saxophone
Hi Ron. Welcome to my site.
Thank you for this information.
I had no idea that Selmer keeps registrations for vintage horns if they are still owned by their original owners. I wonder what the rationale for that is? It certainly can’t be for warranty purposes. In that case, I wonder why they wouldn’t also register horns that others own. Perhaps because there’s too much horn flipping going on these days, and they would constantly have to be updating their database?
In any event, this piece of info you provide it interesting, and potentially helpful to someone else.
I’m glad that you enjoy your Mark VI as much as you do. They are a great horn. I do love mine, and wouldn’t part with them for anything. As much as I enjoy playing my other saxes, in the end I always come back to playing my Mark VIs. There is just something about them that is quite magical.
To me it is just another part of the mystery that lead me into my love of music and what many regarded as a misspent youth consorting with and performing gigs with professional musicians many of whom lived a lifestyle perceived as unsavory. That horn which apparently now has some value, was just my “ax” as we called our instruments. That horn supported my wife and I through undergraduate and law school after I decided that my true love “music” would be a less financially viable alternative to supporting a family in a traditional lifestyle. But, as I am sure you are aware, playing music with other musicians is a spiritual event that you will always be drawn to throughout your life. So I continued playing that horn where I could throughout a naval career into retirement. My ax is truly a treasure to me, regardless of its market value.
I think it is because it is the baseline to which just about everything else — before or since, better or worse — is compared. It achieved this by being the first modern horn, at least as far as the ergonomics and mechanism go. The BA and SBA incorporated the greatly improved pinky cluster but still had the upper and lower stacks inline with each other. The VI offset the right hand stack, and had the tilting Bb spatula which MOST (but certainly not all) of us like. It took 30+ years for the rest of the world to catch up.
I slightly prefer the tilting Bb, but can live without it. As for the other “enhancements” to come along like the plastic tilt thingy between B and C#, I would slightly prefer NOT to have them. It’s not enough to make me alter a horn one way or the other though. The same goes for the rotated right hand stack. It’s better, but not a necessity. I have not played a BA or SBA bari and cannot say if I like the sound better than that of the VI, but if I did that would be reason enough to accept the less refined mechanism. I HAVE played an SBA tenor (for all of five minutes) and did not find it to be all that different from more familiar horns. I also spotted it was a re-lacquer 😯 and didn’t have the heart to tell the owner.
The VI was also a product with a long production run, especially the sopranos and baris. There was outright hostility to the VII in many camps — though a VII alto is a perfectly good horn, and one I would be happy to own. It’s just not a VI. There are even some nice VII tenors. What most people don’t realize is that the late VIs are very different beasts from early VIs. Only the name and overall appearance remained the same, as the details of bore size, tone hole spacing and size, octave pips, brass “thumbs” stuck in the bow, etc. all changed repeatedly over the course of the “Mark VI era”. Comparing a late VI to an early VI is like comparing a SA80 III to the original SA80, except that they didn’t change the name.
Certainly the popularity of the Mark VI is a complex one, and quite possibly worthy of a university thesis. I believe that there are many factors that contribute to its staying power. Versatility in tone is one of the components, as are the factors you list Mal-2. If we posed this question on SOTW or the WF, we would get a whole bunch of other explanations as well.
One of the many Mark VI curiosities which I find interesting, is that depending on what voice of saxophone in question (SATB), will determine the popularity of a certain era of Mark VI. The explanation of this phenomena is, I believe, grounded in both your and my comments about the Mark VI’s ability to maintain its popularity.
When looking at tenor saxes, traditionally it is the 5 digit ones that are the most sought after. Those of course, are the ones most like Getz played. As you mentioned, the VIs changed over the course of their production run. If you look at the prices commanded by the newer VIs, they don’t come close to the 5 digit ones. In other words, people will pay more money for the earlier Mark VI tenor saxes, that had the earlier design, which was the same as Stan Getz played. Presumably it is because these people like Getz’s sound, and would like to be able to incorporate elements of his sound into their playing. (BTW, I’m using only Stan Getz’s name here, but there are certainly other famous players that all played the 5 digit Selmer tenors at the time. They too are the players whose type of sound is being sought after.)
However, if you look at the Mark VI altos, the 5 digit phenomena doesn’t hold up. There, the most highly sought after–read people will pay the most money for–horns are the 1967 Mark VIs that Dave Sanborn, Dulfer, et. al. have made famous. Recently this Mark VI alto sold on eBay for $14,000.
Baritones seem to be all over the map. I have not been able to track a clear trend on a specific era of Mark VI that is most popular. Late model baritones do not appear less popular than their earlier cousins. While Low A models might fetch slightly more than Low Bb models, which decade they’re from, is not necessarily a telltale variable when it comes to price. Did the baritone design change during the 30 year production run of the Mark VI? I’m not sure. Given how long it took Selmer to get the Series III out, I’m not convinced that they would have put much R&D $ into improving their baris. I’d love to know the answer to this question for sure however.
With regards to the sopranos–or as Ed Svoboda calls them, “the ugly step child” of the Mark VI family–here the newest model with the changed bore for improved intonation, appears to gained traction, and tends to be slightly more sought after. However overall, sopranos do remain the least popular of the Mark VI saxophones, and their prices reflect this too.
As I mentioned at the beginning of my comment, there are many curiosities about the Mark VI that I find interesting. This serial #/year popularity is only 1 of them. I do wonder if anyone has ever written a thesis or dissertation that has included information about the Mark VI mystique. It would be a fascinating read.